Wireshark-dev: Re: [Wireshark-dev] Changes to the plugin registration API

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From: João Valverde <j@xxxxxx>
Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2023 20:43:17 +0000


On 04/12/23 18:45, Gerald Combs wrote:
The FAQ entry below makes it clear that developing an internal version of Wireshark is permitted, and that "within an organization" counts as "internal." As far as I know the GPL doesn't place any restrictions on making an internal combined work with GPL and non-GPL software, so writing a non-GPL, internal-only plugin is permitted as long as you take care to keep it internal. I'd personally prefer that plugins were GPL-compatible, but I also know that we live in a real world where that sometimes isn't possible.
There's two things here. Internal use of modified Wireshark source code is allowed, agreed, regardless of any software license. This includes writing and linking binary plugins. All the Wireshark copyright holders already gave permission for that when they licensed their code using the GPL.
I'm less happy about statements that could be construed to imply that GPL compatibility is a matter of convenience in the real world, even obliquely. At best it is an oversimplification to the point of incorrection that sends the wrong message. 

https://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#GPLAndPlugins

https://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#LinkingWithGPL
Gerald: "As far as I know the GPL doesn't place any restrictions on making an internal combined work with GPL and non-GPL software"
Is this really correct? Is it possible to comply with the GPLv2 and modify Wireshark to use a third-party proprietary library, even if it is only used internally? Can corporation A legally modify Wireshark source code to use a proprietary library licensed by corporation B to corporation A, even if they never release this modified version outside of A's organization? I would be surprised if that were the case.
This isn't in contradiction with the fact that writing plugins and not distributing the source code is allowed by the GPL. It does not make much sense to ask if the plugin is compatible or incompatible with the GPL (unless the plugin uses other software already using other licenses). This question of GPL compatibility only poses itself when a license must be granted to a third party to use this (proprietary/secret/whatever) binary plugin as a combined work with Wireshark.
As far as MR 13524 goes, I think adding a "license" field, or even an "internal only" field would be useful, and that showing an "internal only" indicator in the plugin list would be useful as well. Refusing to load a plugin based on that field is needlessly disruptive, and follows neither the letter nor the intent of the GPL. At the very least the check should be removed.
I disagree that being disruptive of license violations (when and if they happen) violates the letter or intent of the GPL. The GPL isn't about removing all restrictions to software but let's skip that debate.
What about my suggestion to add WS_PLUGIN_NO_LICENSE_GRANTED or WS_PLUGIN_PRIVATE_USE or even WS_PLUGIN_IS_INTERNAL_ONLY to the plugin_license_e enum? And continue to disallow loading plugins with WS_PLUGIN_IS_GPLv2_INCOMPATIBLE? 

That's an internal only field.




On 12/4/23 8:33 AM, Gilbert Ramirez wrote:

The GPL FAQ discusses this:
https://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.en.html#InternalDistribution <https://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.en.html#InternalDistribution>
Is making and using multiple copies within one organization or company “distribution”? (#InternalDistribution <https://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.en.html#InternalDistribution>)
    No, in that case the organization is just making the copies for itself. As a consequence, *a company or other organization can develop a modified version and install that version through its own facilities*, without giving the staff permission to release that modified version to outsiders.
    However, when the organization transfers copies to other organizations or individuals, that is distribution. In particular, providing copies to contractors for use off-site is distribution. 


    Gilbert
On Mon, Dec 4, 2023 at 10:30 AM Anders Broman <a.broman58@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:a.broman58@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
https://www.google.com/search?q=company+internal+use+of+gpl+code&oq=company+internal+use+of+gpl+code&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUyBggAEEUYOTIHCAEQIRigAdIBCTIxMDcwajFqN6gCALACAA&client=ms-android-samsung-ss&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8&chrome_dse_attribution=1 <https://www.google.com/search?q=company+internal+use+of+gpl+code&oq=company+internal+use+of+gpl+code&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUyBggAEEUYOTIHCAEQIRigAdIBCTIxMDcwajFqN6gCALACAA&client=ms-android-samsung-ss&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8&chrome_dse_attribution=1>
    For me it is no problem circumventing your code. I'm just questioning if it is the right thing for the project to do. 
    That's it from me.
    Regards
    Anders
    Den mån 4 dec. 2023 17:24João Valverde <j@xxxxxx <mailto:j@xxxxxx>> skrev: 



        On 04/12/23 15:55, Martin Mathieson via Wireshark-dev wrote:
         > I have been doing internal Wireshark releases for years wherever I've          > been working (as far as I know, they have never been sent outside of          > the company).  I have *never* used the plugin mechanism. I package up          > the entire program, even if only one file has been changed.  My          > current company has acquired and merged with several other companies          > and development groups - as far as I can tell, they all have a local 
         > Wireshark person who does the same.  If people are working
         > closely with me, we sometimes even just keep dissectors as part of the          > test code for the project that uses them, and team members build it 
         > themselves.
         >
         > Am I allowed to do this?
        In a strict legal sense I don't think you can use a GPL-incompatible         license for your changes, but it doesn't really matter as long as you         don't distribute it. Otherwise what does it matter which license it uses         or if it doesn't have a license at all? There is no one to license it         to. You are the only one using it and the GPL grants you the right to         modify the software. You can grant yourself only a GPL-license for your 
        modifications and no one else if it gives you peace of mind. :-)
        AFAIK there is also nothing legally preventing someone from rebuilding         Wireshark with a modified source code to ignore the plugin license check         and forget the whole issue, in the same conditions as above, as long as         they don't distribute the proprietary plugin. The GPL violation only         happens if you distribute your plugin using an incompatible license. 

         > Martin
         >
         >
         >
         > On Mon, Dec 4, 2023 at 2:54 PM João Valverde <j@xxxxxx <mailto:j@xxxxxx>> wrote: 
         >
         >
         >
         >     On 04/12/23 14:52, João Valverde wrote:
         >     >
         >     >
         >     > On 04/12/23 14:32, Anders Broman wrote:
         >     >> Hi,
         >     >> Company plug-ins may have restrictive license as the purpose is to          >     >> only use them internally no public usage "secret" code for          >     >> proprietary protocols under patents or IPL. Do we really want to          >     >> forbid that? In that case why should companies provide code to 
         >     >> Wireshark rather than just fork and build internally.
         >     >
         >     > I understand the argument and why that is a point of contention, 
         >     but
         >     > that does not change the terms of the GPL which must be abided 
         >     by even
         >     > if this commit was never merged in the first place.
         >     >
         >     > I don't think it is a question of whether we want to forbid it, 
         >     it is
         >     > whether we can allow it. I believe the answer to that is a clear 
         >     no if
         >     > we want to respect the terms of the GPLv2 (and I'm fine with 
         >     that). I
         >     > am not a license lawyer so this is just my understanding of the 
         >     > legalities involved.
         >     >
         >     ...nor any other kind of lawyer. :-)
         >
         >     > There are many reasons why companies may choose to contribute or 
         >     not.
         >     > Other companies may choose not to contribute to projects not 
         >     using the
         >     > GPL. And individual developers may or may not want to
         >     contribute. Etc.
         >     > We can also debate that but it might veer off-topic.
         >     >
         >     >> Best regards
         >     >
         >     >> A ders
         >     >>
         >     >> Den mån 4 dec. 2023 15:22João Valverde <j@xxxxxx <mailto:j@xxxxxx>> skrev: 
         >     >>
         >     >>
         >     >>
         >     >>     On 04/12/23 13:42, Anders Broman wrote:
         >     >>     > Hi,
         >     >>     > Maybe you are missing the point that someone may wish to 
         >     develop
         >     >>     an in
         >     >>     > house plug-in not meant for distribution which in my 
         >     >>     understanding is
         >     >>     > permissible under GPL.
         >     >>
         >     >>     My understanding is that this is permitted under the GPL if 
         >     using a
         >     >>     GPL-compatible license for your software. It's the main 
         >     difference
         >     >>     between the GPL and so-called "permissive" licenses. 
         >     >>
         >     >>     >
         >     >>     > As I understand it that is no longer possible? To me 
         >     that's an
         >     >>     > unnecessary restriction which we do not need to put on 
         >     our users
         >     >>     and I
         >     >>     > see no point/gain in doing so.
         >     >>
         >     >>     If you don't want to use the GPL you can choose a
         >     GPL-compatible
         >     >>     license
         >     >>     (BSD for example, there are many) and register your plugin with          >     >>     WS_PLUGIN_IS_GPLv2_COMPATIBLE. The SPDX ID is optional but 
         >     helpful.
         >     >>
         >     >>     You may also use GPLv2 and just not distribute your binary 
         >     (in the
         >     >>     case
         >     >>     of businesses and corporations outside of the collective 
         >     entity that
         >     >>     legally comprises it).
         >     >>
         >     >>     So it's not really restricting your freedom to use
         >     Wireshark, it's
         >     >>     just
         >     >>     respecting the terms of the GPL under which developers 
         >     contribute
         >     >>     to the
         >     >>     project.
         >     >>
         >     >>     This is my understanding of the terms under which I choose to 
         >     >>     contribute
         >     >>     to Wireshark. If anyone has a better understanding or 
         >     reason why
         >     >> this
         >     >>     interpretation of the GPL, that matches the FSF FAQ, is wrong, 
         >     >>     please do
         >     >>     share. I'm very open to a good-faith discussion.
         >     >>
         >     >>
         >     >>     > Best regards
         >     >>     > Anders
         >     >>     >
         >     >>     > Den mån 4 dec. 2023 14:05João Valverde <j@xxxxxx <mailto:j@xxxxxx>> skrev: 
         >     >>     >
         >     >>     >     Confused was not an offense, "GPL license" is 
         >     patently not the
         >     >>     >     same as
         >     >>     >     "GPL-compatible license" so it is a legitimate reason 
         >     to be
         >     >>     confused.
         >     >>     >     Please avoid unnecessary and unfair characterizations 
         >     of my
         >     >>     words.
         >     >>     >
         >     >>     >     And I will not revert it on that basis. I will revert 
         >     it if my
         >     >>     >     understanding of the our license requirements is wrong or 
         >     >>     flawed.
         >     >>     >     It is
         >     >>     >     not OK for you to exempt some use-case from the license 
         >     >>     terms under
         >     >>     >     which every developer contributes to this project. 
         >     >>     >
         >     >>     >     Gerald can revert it if he wishes and I will respect 
         >     it. As
         >     >>     >     project lead
         >     >>     >     he can make that call.
         >     >>     >
         >     >>     >     On 04/12/23 12:35, Roland Knall wrote:
         >     >>     >     > I do not think there is a need for calling someone 
         >     confused.
         >     >>     >     >
         >     >>     >     > The whole discussion is not in any way useful for 
         >     our users.
         >     >>     >     There is
         >     >>     >     > the explicit corporate usecase, where in-house 
         >     versions do
         >     >>     exist
         >     >>     >     with
         >     >>     >     > their own protocols and plugins. Often times those 
         >     >>     versions do not
         >     >>     >     > even deal with licenses for those modifications at 
         >     all, and
         >     >>     >     going from
         >     >>     >     > the point that they change the CMakeListsCustom.txt 
         >     >> files, one
         >     >>     >     could
         >     >>     >     > argue, that this is not a source code modification 
         >     in the
         >     >>     sense
         >     >>     >     meant
         >     >>     >     > by the gpl license.
         >     >>     >     >
         >     >>     >     > Joao, I agree with having a clear path for license 
         >     >>     application,
         >     >>     >     and I
         >     >>     >     > also agree that we should be prudent on what parts 
         >     a user
         >     >> can
         >     >>     >     use and
         >     >>     >     > which he can't. I would even be ok if we have a 
         >     warning
         >     >> in the
         >     >>     >     > build-process, explicitly stating that the code being 
         >     >>     linked is not
         >     >>     >     > fully compliant and therefore not allowed to be 
         >     >>     distributed. But I
         >     >>     >     > strongly disagree cutting off the leg we are 
         >     standing on
         >     >>     just on
         >     >>     >     pure
         >     >>     >     > principle. The corporate users are a HUGE part of our 
         >     >>     userbase.
         >     >>     >     And if
         >     >>     >     > we go down this route, we need to have a proper 
         >     discussion
         >     >>     about
         >     >>     >     this.
         >     >>     >     > Just adding license enforcement without having the 
         >     >>     discussion is
         >     >>     >     NOT
         >     >>     >     > the way to move forward here.
         >     >>     >     >
         >     >>     >     > Please add another patch, which keeps the ABI 
         >     versioning in
         >     >>     >     (which I
         >     >>     >     > really appreciate and think is a good thing to do), but 
         >     >>     reverts the
         >     >>     >     > enforcement of the licenses. Then we can start to 
         >     properly
         >     >>     >     discuss how
         >     >>     >     > to move forward with this topic. It will - most 
         >     likely -
         >     >>     require a
         >     >>     >     > vote by the technical steering comittee.
         >     >>     >     >
         >     >>     >     > kind regards
         >     >>     >     > Roland
         >     >>     >     >
         >     >>     >     > Am Mo., 4. Dez. 2023 um 13:23 Uhr schrieb João Valverde 
         >     >>     <j@xxxxxx <mailto:j@xxxxxx>>:
         >     >>     >     >
         >     >>     >     >
         >     >>     >     >
         >     >>     >     >     On 04/12/23 12:19, João Valverde wrote: 
         >     >>     >     >     >
         >     >>     >     >     >
         >     >>     >     >     > On 04/12/23 12:12, Bálint Réczey wrote:          >     >>     >     >     >> João Valverde <j@xxxxxx <mailto:j@xxxxxx>> ezt írta (időpont: 
         >     2023.
         >     >>     dec. 4., H,
         >     >>     >     >     12:59):
         >     >>     >     >     >>>
         >     >>     >     >     >>>
         >     >>     >     >     >>> On 03/12/23 23:25, João Valverde wrote: 
         >     >>     >     >  >>>> Hi,
         >     >>     >     >  >>>>
         >     >>     >     >  >>>> There are some changes in progress to the 
         >     plugin
         >     >>     >     registration
         >     >>     >     >     API that
         >     >>     >     >  >>>> break compatibility and require manual 
         >     intervention
         >     >>     >     from plugin
         >     >>     >     >  >>>> authors maintaining plugins out-of-tree. These 
         >     >>     changes
         >     >>     >     are rather
         >     >>     >     >  >>>> minor and concern only plugin
         >     registration, not
         >     >>     other APIs
         >     >>     >     >     accessible
         >     >>     >     >  >>>> to plugins.
         >     >>     >     >  >>>>
         >     >>     >     >  >>>> See MR 13524:
         >     >>     >     >  >>>>
         >     >>     > https://gitlab.com/wireshark/wireshark/-/merge_requests/13524 <https://gitlab.com/wireshark/wireshark/-/merge_requests/13524> 
         >     >>     >     >  >>>>
         >     >>     >     >  >>>> Changes required are rewriting the
         >     registration
         >     >>     code (very
         >     >>     >     >     easy to do
         >     >>     >     >  >>>> [1]) and declare (using a C enum) that the 
         >     >> plugin is
         >     >>     >     released
         >     >>     >     >     either
         >     >>     >     >  >>>> under GPLv2 or later, or a GPLv2 compatible 
         >     >>     license. The
         >     >>     >     >     other changes
         >     >>     >     >  >>>> to the ABI version number are
         >     >>     >     >     >>> The choice of the word "released" here was 
         >     >>     unfortunate,
         >     >>     >     >     because it may
         >     >>     >     >     >>> imply distribution. Please consider "licensed" 
         >     >>     instead.
         >     >>     >     >     >>>
         >     >>     >     >     >>> The license declaration field just affirms what 
         >     >>     was already
         >     >>     >     >     implicit:
         >     >>     >     >     >>> Wireshark plugins must use licensing terms 
         >     >> compatible
         >     >>     >     with the GPL
         >     >>     >     >     >>> version 2, so there is no policy change there.          >     >>     >     >     >> GPL allows linking and using GPL-licensed 
         >     software
         >     >> with
         >     >>     >     >     >> non-GPL-licensed software locally. This is an 
         >     >> important
         >     >>     >     use case of
         >     >>     >     >     >> many Wireshark users who do not wish releasing 
         >     >>     their plugins
         >     >>     >     >     and your
         >     >>     >     >     >> change broke that. Please revert it. 
         >     >>     >     >     >>
         >     >>     >     >     >
         >     >>     >     >     >
         >     >> https://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#IfLibraryIsGPL <https://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#IfLibraryIsGPL> 
         >     >>     >     >
         >     >>     >     >     Also it does not require a GPL license, it 
         >     requires a
         >     >>     >     GPL-compatible
         >     >>     >     >     license, so you may just be confused.
         >     >>     >     >
         >     >>     >     >     >
         >     >>     >     >  >>>> currently not relevant to plugin authors 
         >     (no policy
         >     >>     >     change is
         >     >>     >     >  >>>> implied), it just uses less boilerplate with 
         >     >> macros.
         >     >>     >     >  >>>>
         >     >>     >     >  >>>> This should improve the plug-in experience 
         >     for both
         >     >>     >     >     developers and
         >     >>     >     >  >>>> users and may improve compatibility in the 
         >     future.
         >     >>     >     >     >>
         >     >>     >     >  >>>> Comments welcome.
         >     >>     >     >  >>>>
         >     >>     >     >  >>>> Regards,
         >     >>     >     >  >>>>
         >     >>     >     >  >>>> João
         >     >>     >     >  >>>>
         >     >>     >     >  >>>>
         >     >>     >     >
         >     >>     >
         >     >>
         >    [1]https://gitlab.com/wireshark/wireshark/-/commit/90b16b40921b737aadf9186685d866fd80e37ee6#4a1fe9011e8240918e5fc6230c0bcd2e4d3b9c34 <https://gitlab.com/wireshark/wireshark/-/commit/90b16b40921b737aadf9186685d866fd80e37ee6#4a1fe9011e8240918e5fc6230c0bcd2e4d3b9c34> 
         >     >>     >     >
         >     >>     >     >  >>>>
         >     >>     >     >  >>>>
         >     >>     >     >  >>>>
         >     >>     >     >
         >     >>     >
         >     >>
         >    ___________________________________________________________________________ 
         >     >>     >     >
         >     >>     >     >  >>>>
         >     >>     >     >  >>>>
         >     >>     >     >  >>>> Sent via: Wireshark-dev mailing list
         >     >>     >     >  <wireshark-dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:wireshark-dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>> 
         >     >>     >     >  >>>> Archives:
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         >     >>     >     >  >>>> Unsubscribe:
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